January 10, 2010

Who is the True Tea Party Candidate?

One of the most interesting side-effects of seismic, sudden change within a society is that it almost always creates a counter-culture bent on either resisting the establishment’s efforts to exact that change or forcing the establishment to allow that change. The last major counter-cultural movement took place in the mid-20th Century. Then, a number of cultural changes — including the advent of the nuclear family, the rise of mass media, and the coming of age of a sizable generation in the Baby Boomers who lacked any psychological connection with pre-WWII, pre-Depression America and its traditions — resulted in a movement that led Americans to take to the streets in order to enact major societal changes that many Americans felt the establishment of the time was resisting. The cultural revolution that resulted changed the social landscape of the nation quickly, dramatically, and irreversibly.

A year ago, the Tea Party movement seemed like a motley crew of partisans and pseudo-secessionists, a vocal yet tiny minority of McCain/Palin voters who weren’t ready to peel the bumper stickers from their cars just yet. But since then, the Democratic government’s leftward movement combined with continued economic, fiscal, and international travails have caused the Tea Parties to go mainstream. All of the sudden, freedom is cool again. Ayn Rand’s books are flying off the shelves as a new counter-culture is born. Like the last significant counter-culture that our nation experienced, Tea Partiers are organized, raucous, and have an affinity for a good public demonstration. Unlike the Boomers of the ’60s, though, Tea Partiers are marching not for social progress, but for economic (and thus personal) freedom. As mainstream disaffecteds see the right to make their own medical decisions threatened, as they begin to fear a future in which they are taxed out of existence due to the unsustainable growth of government, and as the state and the nation’s large corporate interests, such as banks, auto manufacturers, and health insurance companies that are all “too big to fail,” start to become one and the same — bailed out with taxpayers’ money, protected from a true market with real competition, and made overlords of a new feudalism and a new road to serfdom — those same mainstream Americans who once looked at the Tea Partiers with smirks on their faces are now joining the party.

But is there a presidential candidate who embodies the principles of the Tea Partiers, with their opposition to big government, high taxation, debt and spending, and collusion between the state and too-big-to-fail institutions? The conventional wisdom is that Sarah Palin will be the Tea Party candidate in the GOP primaries, running as a symbol of rebellion against Obama and Obama-ism. I suspect that Palin will receive a significant amount of Tea Party support, and perhaps even become the favored candidate of Tea Partiers. But I also think that, should he choose to run, former New Mexico Gov. Gary Johnson would give the Alaskan a run for her money amongst the disaffecteds and is a much more natural fit for the Tea Partiers inasmuch as Johnson, not Palin, is the candidate who is least like Obama in the race.

I would distinguish Gov. Palin and Gov. Johnson thusly: Sarah Palin is the Republican Obama, while Gary Johnson is the Anti-Obama. In other words, it is Palin who is the right-wing version of President Obama, while Johnson is the polar opposite of Obama in every way. Palin, like the president, was elected statewide once in one of her party’s base states. Both are in their 40s. Neither completed their first and only terms in office. Both became popular not for their positions, but for their charisma and because of their cultural cues, with Obama as the effete academic that liberals have always wanted as president, and Palin as the religious working-class hero that today’s conservatives want. Both champion a supposed new kind of politics, yet neither actually deviate from party orthodoxy on any major issues, with Obama’s presidency starting where LBJ’s left off and with Palin giving no indication that her presidency wouldn’t begin where Bush’s ended, complete with more tax cuts not paid for with spending cuts and vibrant neoconservatism. As such, Palin, while being a heroine of the anti-establishment, is viewed by many as a Trojan Horse of that very establishment that disaffecteds despise.

Gov. Johnson, meanwhile, comes out of the gate as a more mainstream version of Ron Paul, and he brings with him Paul’s mix of classical liberalism and classical conservatism. A two-term governor of a purple state, Johnson championed school vouchers and shifted Medicaid to managed care, all while advocating the de-criminalization of marijuana. Johnson is personally supportive of abortion remaining legal, but would send the decision on the issue back into the political process. On foreign policy, Johnson is opposed to continued U.S. involvement in the Middle East and believes that America should use its military only to advance U.S. interests. And Johnson, like the disaffecteds, opposes the recklessness that has led to our fiscal situation and believes that action must be taken to dramatically reduce deficits (one of Johnson’s claims to fame is his record of vetoing over one thousand spending items as governor).

If I’m reading Palin right, and it’s certainly possible that I am not, I suspect that she will run a traditional Republican campaign on tax cuts without spending cuts, on endless war in the Middle East, and on replacing Obama’s cultural bossiness with her own. In that sense, I would opine that it is Johnson, not Palin, who should be, and could be, the candidate of the disaffecteds. Obama and Palin will continue to run up the bill for future generations; Johnson would cut off the tab and pay it. Obama and Palin would regulate Americans’ lives “for their own good;” Johnson would pull back the state’s interference with individual autonomy. Obama and Palin will continue to use the military to modernize the Middle East; Johnson would use the military to defend the United States and her interests. Obama and Palin differ only regarding the values which they would promote via government; Johnson’s values are those of the classical liberal (the primacy of the individual) and of the classical conservative (realism, limits, thrift).

A perfect example of all of this can be found in the various candidates’ approach to the environment. Obama, of course, is a student of the left-wing school of thought that promotes enacting policies that benefit the environment even if the impact on humans is a negative one. Individual rights and economic growth then become less important than nature because, to leftists, nature should be revered as a deity. Sarah Palin’s response to Obama’s environmental policies, though, was striking inasmuch as while it rightly opposed the president’s plans, it still left the human will in bondage to the world around it. Palin’s “tweet” on the subject was as follows:

Copenhgen=arrogance of man2think we can change nature’s ways.MUST b good stewards of God’s earth,but arrogant&naive2say man overpwers nature

Earth saw clmate chnge4 ions;will cont 2 c chnges.R duty2responsbly devlop resorces4humankind/not pollute&destroy;but cant alter naturl chng

I don’t necessarily disagree with the policy implications of this statement but the underlying ideology seems no different than Obama’s. To both Obama and Palin, man must submit to nature. That’s because to Palin, nature is under the control of a deity and, to Obama, nature is a deity. To both, man is a slave. And how does Gary Johnson approach the seemingly insurmountable obstacles of nature? He climbed to the top of Mount Everest. With a broken leg. Obama and Palin submit to nature. Gary Johnson conquers nature.

It’s possible that Johnson, like Ron Paul, will fade into the background as a quirky candidate whose views are unacceptable to the majority of Americans. In fact, it may even be probable that this will happen. But given the nature of today’s disaffecteds, given the things that are causing them to be disaffected, and given that the nation may be looking for a president who reminds them the least of President Obama in 2012, it shouldn’t be a foregone conclusion that Palin and not Johnson will capture the hearts of Tea Partiers everywhere. Johnson’s admiration for acts of the human will combined with his hardcore fiscal conservatism and foreign policy skepticism makes him a balanced fusion of classical conservatism and classical liberalism, while Obama is the antithesis of both of those things. If the Tea Party movement becomes about changing the underlying assumptions of government rather than simply replacing a left-wing version of it with a right-wing version, anything could happen.

by @ 5:24 pm. Filed under 2012 Misc., Barack Obama, Gary Johnson, Sarah Palin
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203 Responses to “Who is the True Tea Party Candidate?”

  1. Angus Logan Says:

    Good piece, but if the GOP panders to the Tea baggers and nominate palin for 2012, that would spell the doom of the party. Even a blind can sense that Mitt is better suited.

  2. Tommy Boy Says:

    Total non-sequiter but what’s going on with Intrade today, heh heh.

  3. spinnikerca Says:

    The first tea party was during Ron Paul’s campaign. A bunch of tea partiers like Palin and came later. However, as between Ron Paul and Gary Johnson, if RP runs, the excitement will be with Ron Paul. Nothing beats a consistent 30 year record when people are feeling skeptical.

  4. hamaca Says:

    Interesting analysis and questions. There have comments recently that would indicate to me that Tea Partiers won’t necessarily vote as a bloc and may have quite differing opinions as to who is electable and who would govern closer to their individual preferences.

    I’d love to see stats/polls showing the make-up of Tea Partiers–would that include everyone who has actually been to an event even once? Or only those who are more active in the various movements? What about those who have never been to an event, but who identify with what is going on there?

  5. conservmom Says:

    third partie’s won’t win. Just ask President Perot.

  6. Tommy Boy Says:

    Hamaca,

    I think we have to identify what Dave means when he talks about “tea partiers.”

    According to the following Rasmussen poll, 54% of Republicans and 47% of independents think the average Republican in Congress is too liberal (note that the indies that Rasmussen finds are more conservative than other pollsters).

    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/january_2010/75_of_gop_voters_still_think_their_legislators_out_of_touch

    I would argue that 54% of Republicans and 47% of indies represent the “tea-party” movement, though they may not attend tea party functions.

  7. hamaca Says:

    Tommy,

    I wonder what proportion of the 54% and 47% you’re suggesting would actually see themselves as part of the Tea Party movement. I’d venture a guess that a significant number would not for various reasons, including simply not following politics as much and therefore not realizing their views may overlap.

    If true, what you’re saying is interesting in that a voter does not necessarily have to self identify with the movement in order to be considered by hacks, bloggers, and analysts to be part of it.

  8. Tommy Boy Says:

    #7 That is what I’m saying effectively.

    I think that you are generally right: if you asked them whether they are “part” of the tea-party movement, I’d agree that half of them would say no given how vague an idea the “tea-party” movement is.

    However, I’d also argue that they share the same vision and beliefs of the tea-party movement, including the types of candidates that they would support in a primary. For example, guess is that 90% of the 54% and 47% would support what happened in NY-23 and would support primary challenges across the country.

  9. HYUFD Says:

    1 – But if the party wants ‘change’ on a Tea Party, small town values ticket then the corporate Romney will never represent it when compared to the excitement of Palin. She could end up the GOP McGovern, but for the true conservative believers, like the liberals in 1972, it would be one hell of a ride!

  10. Gary Johnson 2012 Says:

    Wow! Very thought-provoking piece. I’ve never thought of Johnson and Palin in that context before.

  11. Martha Says:

    3. Ron Paul over Gary Johnson??? I don’t think so. Heck the guy even appeals to me.

  12. Aron Goldman Says:

    It’s possible that Johnson, like Ron Paul, will fade into the background as a quirky candidate whose views are unacceptable to the majority of Americans. In fact, it may even be probable that this will happen.

    Gary Johnson
    November 28, 2009
    http://ouramericainitiative.com/issues/defense-and-the-middle-east-war.html

    “I think that [the war in Iraq] has been a real failure as we can see today.”

    NBC/Wall Street Journal Political Survey
    December 11-14, 2009
    http://race42008.com/2009/12/16/poll-watch-nbcwall-street-journal-political-survey-4/

    Do you think the war in Iraq has been very successful, somewhat successful, somewhat unsuccessful, or very unsuccessful?

    •Very successful 7%
    •Somewhat successful 50%
    •Somewhat unsuccessful 18%
    •Very unsuccessful 22%

    I’d also love to get Tania Reiman’s take on Gary Johnson incongruously shaking his head ‘no’ as he’s saying “I believe in a strong national defense” at the 0:20 second mark in this video clip.

  13. Tommy Boy Says:

    #12 This guy is a perfect third-party candidate for us if he also jumps aboard the gay-marriage bandwagon.

    We need to get some major donors around him and see if he’ll play the part.

  14. Tommy Boy Says:

    Palin/VP 46%
    Obama/Biden 46%
    Johnson/VP: 7%

    If we’re within 1.5 million votes of Obama in the popular vote, we probably win this thing.

  15. Martha Says:

    8. Tommy Boy,

    There is not a good definition for what the tea party really is. It seems to be a movement that doesn’t quite know what it is all about – except anger.

    For instance, I’m just as ticked about the government takeover of everything as the next person, and I want gov to get the heck out of my life. Does that make me a member of the tea party? Yet, I’m not too worried about Obama’s birth certificate – as many of them seem to be. And I don’t support what happened in NY23 – at all.

    I would like to see some polling on it, with solid definitions.

  16. Tommy Boy Says:

    #15 I would define a “tea-party” Republican as anyone who believes the GOP is too liberal/Congressional Republicans are too liberal. That is essentially the “tea-party” mindset if you are asking what is the mindset of hte “tea-party” movement from a pure political standpoint in my opinion.

    “I would like to see some polling on it, with solid definitions.”

    If you accept that definition, then Rasmussen just polled it for you.

  17. AKReport Says:

    New 2012 Rankings http://republicanrankings.blogspot.com/2010/01/new-rankings-palins-major-srlc-speech.html

  18. AKReport Says:

    ever since Sarah Palin’s RNC speech the conservative movement has been fully energized.

  19. Martha Says:

    Tommy Boy,

    That just doesn’t seem like a very adequate definition. I doubt that is the way most tea-partiers would define themselves.

  20. Martha Says:

    18. Yes, her initial speech energized McCain’s campaign. However, most of us refused to close our eyes to what we learned about Palin post convention.

  21. MetroIndependent Says:

    Glad to see DaveG has come around, as he used to write stuff firmly claiming nobody would ever take small-government ideas seriously again.

  22. Heath Says:

    Perry/De Mint (at least until the election then it may be Palin/Johnson).

  23. Martha Says:

    I little aside from Game Change:

    during debate preps, some staff members assigned to Sarah Palin by the McCain campaign discussed the “threatening possibility: that Palin was mentally unstable.” They add that several of Senator John McCain’s lieutenants agreed that if it looked as if their candidate might actually win in November, they would have to discuss how to relegate Ms. Palin “to the largely ceremonial role that premodern vice presidents inhabited”: “it was inconceivable” that “if McCain fell ill or died, the country be left in the hands of a President Palin.”

    Sorry, couldn’t resist.

  24. AKReport Says:

    martha, “Game change” is just a book of anonymous sources and liberal talking points.

  25. Jay Says:

    Counter culture? I don’t think so. It is the idiots in Washington who are out of wack. Not normal people (that’s what they are) resisting radical change that is not mainstream. So if anything, Obama and his union thugs are the counterculture.

  26. AKReport Says:

    martha how can you take anonymous sources as fact? who do you trust more Sarah Palin, or the anonymous ones who want to destroy her?

  27. conservmom Says:

    LOLOL…. kiss of death. Nominating Palin in 12. Obama for 4 more if she manages to get on the ticket.

  28. Bob Hovic Says:

    I would define a “tea-party” Republican as anyone who believes the GOP is too liberal/Congressional Republicans are too liberal.

    I would agree with Martha on this point — I think this definition is so broad as to be meaningless. As you note above, it covers 54% of Republicans and 47% of Indies.

    The problem with defining the Tea Party movement is that it is a true grass roots movement — there are no membership cards, no registration, no platform to sign on to. People join up for a variety of reasons.

    An equally valid definition would be that it includes anybody who is fed up with the country’s current direction and distrustful of “The Establishment”. But I’m not sure that gets us any closer to figuring out who they will vote for.

  29. conservmom Says:

    Lets take a look at Palin’s record. As Mayor of that huge metro, Wassilla, she managed to leave it MILLIONS in debt for a sports complex they did not need, and she did not have the land rights too (and they are STILL in court over it). Oh, she did dole out 1200 bucks per person in AK, right before the election. that would make me popular too, until the money ran out. She circumvented standard communication practices (and secure practices) by using private e-mails to conduct state business, she used her office to intimidate a former brother in law. (The Branchflower report on troopergate DID NOT fall in her favor, as she likes everyone to believe)….Some of the Ethic’s violations were bogus, but some had much merit such as forcing her pay back money for her children’s travel. She up and quit her job when the people of AK had started to hold her accountable for that job (and the cash helped). She’s got a family that belongs on Jerry Springer, and not on the National stage. That’s most likely not ALL her fault. Sometimes kids go bad. However, statsically a mother who is home with kids when they are still in school, has a higher chance of having children that don’t do drugs, don’t smoke, don’t sleep around, go on to College, and be decent folks. (Ask Dr. Laura). Time for Career after kids are gone. But don’t parade them around and make a national joke out of a unwed pregnant teen, who will later go on to be a ‘spokesperson’ for Abstence. News flash. The time for abstence was before the baby was conceived.
    Should the GOP have a stupid attack, and nominate Palin, we will lose the white house. All that work to get good solid conservatives elected in 10 and 12 will be thrown away by giving Obama 4 more to work his MoJo.

  30. Win M. Says:

    “martha how can you take anonymous sources as fact? who do you trust more Sarah Palin, or the anonymous ones who want to destroy her?”

    At this point, I’ll trust pretty much anyone over Palin. How many demonstrably false lies does she have to tell before she’s totally discredited? For instance, that the ethics report exonerated her? That was completely, manifestly untrue.

  31. AKReport Says:

    Nominating Palin in 12 depends on how well she does in the debates. If she kicks ass then she will crush Obama. there is no “kiss of death” palin has ALL the talents needed to beat obama.

    fundraising,fan base,crowds,charisma,media control,speeches,and first women narative. The only thing she needs is time. weather she is ready in 2012 we will know in the debates

  32. AKReport Says:

    “For instance, that the ethics report exonerated her? That was completely, manifestly untrue”

    Well that report cleared her in legal terms. she did not violate any ethics laws, because the person who was dismissed was an at will position. she could fire him for any reason what so ever.

    the 2nd report fully cleared her. http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-11-03-troopergate_N.htm

  33. narciso Says:

    How does one get things so wrong, you’ve seen her budgets from 2007-on, they are on a marked decrease from Democratic and Republican predecessors alike. Are we still going on about a sports stadium, a dozen years in the past, which was financed through a bond issue, which the people had to vote for. The Branchflower report, which one of the originators was rewarded with a position in the Obama interior department. You ignore the Petumenous report which is nonpartisan. You ignore her filings against the EPA determination on the polar bear, or the pressure to actually get Exxon to drill the wells at Point Thompson. You ignore the HK speech where she outlines which are the conditions where and when US forces should be used. As I read Gary Johnson, he doesn’t seem willing
    to commit to Afghanistan or Yemen, or any operation that we can see.

  34. marK Says:

    “True Tea Party Candidate”

    Is that anything like a “True Conservative” or a “True Republican”?

  35. narciso Says:

    What made her unstable, that she gave a damn about where this country was headed under Obama, that she knew that the lives of her son and thousands of others would be less safe, under an administration that eschews the rightness of our values, and the important of our mission, although
    she didn’t think that this would become so literally true in Little Rock and Killeen. Was she right
    to be concerned about someone who wanted to share the wealth, who thought that only bitter people cling to their guns and their wealth, who would give Miranda rights, and a get out of jail free
    card for terrorists. Is that crazy, or was that a legitimate concern.

  36. OHIO JOE Says:

    “Lets take a look at Palin’s record. As Mayor of that huge metro, Wassilla, she managed to leave it MILLIONS in debt for a sports complex they did not need, and she did not have the land rights too (and they are STILL in court over it). ” Yet another false smear from the Romney camp. The people voter for the sports complex. Mrs. Palin did not force it on the people.

  37. craigs Says:

    36 Ohio Joe

    If the people voted for it, O.J., what’s the court case all about…….and what good friend of Sarah’s made a bundle of money off the Sports Complex deal ?

  38. Aron Goldman Says:

    Petraeus: U.S. has plan to deal with Iran’s nuclear program
    http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/01/09/petraeus.iran/index.html?iref=allsearch

    In addition to diplomacy and sanctions, the United States has developed contingency plans in dealing with Iran’s nuclear facilities, a top U.S. military commander told CNN’s Christiane Amanpour.

    Gen. David Petraeus, head of U.S. Central Command, did not elaborate on the plans in the interview, to be aired Sunday. But he said the military has considered the impacts of any action taken there.

    “It would be almost literally irresponsible if CENTCOM were not to have been thinking about the various ‘what ifs’ and to make plans for a whole variety of different contingencies,” Petraeus told Amanpour at the command’s headquarters in Tampa.

    Iran’s nuclear program has become a thorn for the United States and its allies, and Washington has sharpened its tone on dealings over Tehran’s program. The Islamic republic maintains the program is for peaceful purposes, but the United States and other Western nations fear Iran wants to acquire nuclear weapons.

    Israel has called Iran’s nuclear program the major threat facing its nation.

    When asked about rumors that Israel could attack Iran’s facilities, Petraeus declined to comment about Israel’s military capabilities. But when asked about the vulnerability of the facilities, Petraeus said Iran has strengthened the facilities and has enhanced underground tunnels.

    Still, the facilities are not bomb-proof.

    “Well, they certainly can be bombed,” he said. “The level of effect would vary with who it is that carries it out, what ordnance they have, and what capability they can bring to bear.”

    Iran is holding out on a United Nations-backed deal on its nuclear program that includes enriching uranium. The country had until the end of 2009 to accept the deal offered by the “P5 plus one” — permanent U.N. Security Council members Britain, China, France, Russia and the United States, plus Germany. Instead, Iran countered, giving the West until the end of January to accept its own proposal.

    The general said he thinks there is still time for the nations to engage Iran in diplomacy, noting there is no deadline on the enactment of any U.S. contingency plans.

    He added, however, that “there’s a period of time, certainly, before all this might come to a head, if you will.”

    NBC/Wall Street Journal Political Survey
    October 22-25, 2009
    http://race42008.com/2009/10/27/poll-watch-nbcwall-street-journal-political-survey-3/#more-21167

    Thinking about Iran, if Iran continues with its nuclear research and is close to developing a nuclear weapon, do you believe that the United States should or should not initiate military action to destroy Iran’s ability to make nuclear weapons? Do you feel strongly about that, or not?

    •Feel strongly the U.S. should initiate military action 45%
    •Feel the U.S. should initiate military action 7%
    •Feel the U.S. should not initiate military action 10%
    •Feel strongly the U.S. should not initiate military action 27%

    Pew Research Survey on Iranian Nuclear Program
    September 30 – October 4, 2009
    http://race42008.com/2009/10/06/poll-watch-pew-research-survey-on-iranian-nuclear-program/

    In your opinion, which is more important — to prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, even if it means taking military action, or to avoid a military conflict with Iran, even if it means they may develop nuclear weapons?

    •To prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, even if it means taking military action 61%
    •To avoid a military conflict with Iran, even if it means they may develop nuclear weapons 24%

    Among Democrats

    •To prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, even if it means taking military action 51%
    •To avoid a military conflict with Iran, even if it means they may develop nuclear weapons 31%

    Among Republicans

    •To prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, even if it means taking military action 71%
    •To avoid a military conflict with Iran, even if it means they may develop nuclear weapons 16%

    Among Independents

    •To prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, even if it means taking military action 66%
    •To avoid a military conflict with Iran, even if it means they may develop nuclear weapons 22%

  39. conservmom Says:

    OJ. I’m not smearing her. I’m stating facts. I’ve pleanty in my quiver to toss out that would smear her. But let’s just stick to facts. I gave you several, provable and very public facts.

  40. conservmom Says:

    Ms. Palin also negelected to tell the electorate that the land was not clear.

  41. Martha Says:

    Conservmom,

    Everyone should remember that Palin also hired a city manager to do her job (in the tiny town of Wasilla? Please.), and hired a person to find as much federal pork as possible.

    A sports complex was a justifiable eminent domain case? Don’t think so. There’s one set of rules for Palin, and another for everyone else.

    Terrible interviews, no problem. Winks and kisses/no substance debate? No problem. Lies, no problem. Ethical lapses for pit bull reform lady? No prob.

    I think Palin gets a pass on everything because she is a somewhat attractive woman with a good story. No way would conservatives ever go ga ga over a man who had her same set of issues.

    DaveG is exactly right about Palin being the Republican Obama.

  42. Martha Says:

    35. Narciso, what makes Palin unstable, (and unfit for national office in my opinion), are her very apparent narcissistic tendencies. Yet again, another similarity with Obama.

  43. narciso Says:

    An interesting poll, it shows that there are some people who really see the longterm consequences of
    the hapless policy that Obama has followed through, aided by the fabricators in the DNI which sabotaged any Bush administration initiative.

  44. narciso Says:

    Really does she speak so often in the first person singular, or is it more I and we. Does she start
    sentence with ‘As I always said’

  45. Norm Says:

    “a vocal yet tiny minority of McCain/Palin voters who weren’t ready to peel the bumper stickers from their cars just yet.”

    Oh please that isn’t even close to what the tea party started from. The tea party was catalyzed from libertarian minded constitutionalist that the GOP had drifted away from. There was no one to speak for them until the presidential campaign of Ron Paul. Then meetup groups formed spontaneously to support Dr. Paul (with no direction from any organized campaign). Tea partiers want congress to leave them the hell alone so they can live free and pursue happiness according to their own values. Congress continues to operate (no matter who’s in power) as if they know whats best and how to run your lives. Ron Paul was the only GOP presidential candidate that understands that.

    Sound like you guys are to bogged down in the us vs them politics of left vs right which is a gross over simplification of the political spectrum yet we continue to model people this way. A better model is the worlds smallest political quiz found at http://www.theadvocates.org/quizp/index.html

  46. Alex Knepper Says:

    DaveG, you mention Ayn Rand in a lot of your pieces. Are you a fan, by chance?

  47. ac1 Says:

    http://www.redinvadesblue.com/Moneybomb/Donate.html

    Our one chance to stop health care,

  48. narciso Says:

    So, by your lights, Dagny Taggart is a narcissist, she demands exceedingly high standards, she doesn’t suffer fools gladly if at all. She undertakes large complex programs that many say are prone to failure.

  49. conservmom Says:

    And Taggart will show up at the airport with scantly clad show gals from Vegas, as she did with McCain.

    Sex sells. You betcha, wink wink.

  50. narciso Says:

    De verdad que no vale la pena discutir con usted, senora”

  51. No RomneyCare! Says:

    We

    LOVE

    Sarah :) :) :)

  52. conservmom Says:

    OMG. They used YOUTUBE to vet Palin? I’m not getting warm fuzzies out of my own party, regarding competence.

  53. NDconservative Says:

    North Dakota John Hoeven to announce U.S. Senate attentions tomorrow evening.

  54. conservmom Says:

    And narcicso, it’s not worth having an argument with you, ‘Sir’.

  55. NDconservative Says:

    North Dakota Governor*

  56. No RomneyCare! Says:

    The Palin bashers here sound EXACTLY like the nutjobs over at the Daily Kos about her.

    I wonder why????????????????????????

    Markos, Martha, Conservmom (and the Rombot troups) parroting each other’s talking points…

    AND now we know the rest of the story. ;)

  57. hamaca Says:

    51. Who’s “we”? You and those three smiley faces?

    (By this comment, I’m not inferring that only four people in total love Sarah–I know there are many)

  58. Martha Says:

    Schmidt basically admits what I’ve said from the very first week about Palin. They did n’t realize her inadequacies until after she had been chosen.

    All this Free Sarah business was nonsense. The campaign did the only thing they could do – which was to tightly control Palin to limit the potential damage.

  59. No RomneyCare! Says:

    53. GREAT news! :)

    “I Hope Gov. John Hoeven Will Consider Running For U.S. Senate…

    Wednesday, January 6, 2010 at 8:01pm

    John Hoeven and I are good friends. I have long admired the way he has governed North Dakota. With our debt skyrocketing and the government TAKEOVER of our health care system looming, we need a strong conservative voice in the U.S. Senate.

    Yesterday, Democrat Senator Byron Dorgan announced he is retiring from the Senate. I hope John will consider running for this Senate seat. We need his leadership in the Senate.”

  60. No RomneyCare! Says:

    http://www.facebook.com/notes/mike-huckabee/i-hope-gov-john-hoeven-will-consider-running-for-us-senate/237889028615

  61. Aron Goldman Says:

    A ‘Terrifying’, ‘Mentally Limited’ V.P.
    According to reporters Mark Halperin of Time and John Heilemann of New York Magazine, some McCain staffers were considering an unheard of request if McCain was elected president.

    Watch CBS News Videos Online

  62. No RomneyCare! Says:

    57. WATCH the upcoming POLLS …

    and don’t cry. ;)

  63. No RomneyCare! Says:

    CBS is the TOOL of the left.

  64. Buckeye Says:

    What I took away from this article that Sarah Palin confuses “IONS” and “EONS.” I mean, seriously, is that some inside joke I’m missing?

  65. Adam Says:

    Dick Cheney thought she was a bad choice for VP.

  66. No RomneyCare! Says:

    61.

    60 minutes is a liberal propaganda joke.

    Sorry, Aaron – for my bluntness. : )

  67. Aron Goldman Says:

    Regrets Over Palin?
    Mark Halperin of Time and John Heilemann of New York Magazine on the regrets felt by McCain campaign staffers over the choice of Sarah Palin as nominee to be vice president.

    Watch CBS News Videos Online

  68. Aron Goldman Says:

    Revelations From The Campaign
    Authors of a new book, “Game Change,” and John McCain’s former top campaign strategist reveal behind-the-scenes issues from the GOP and Democratic camps during the campaign. Anderson Cooper reports.

    Watch CBS News Videos Online

  69. narciso Says:

    You know you are not going to win the argument with those pics, What was McCain’s campaign by late September, had he chosen to point out that he along with President Bush, had been the leading figures on subprime reform, but Dodd, and Frank, and Biden and Obama, by his inaction stood in the way. How they had commandeered lobbyists like Newt to block any such plans. But he did none of that, maybe he didn’t remember, or Schmidt didn’t care to remind him. Who reminded people of the fact that
    under Obama ‘electricity prices would have to skyrocket naturally’, or the philosophical kinship of Obama and Ayers. You know she rarely says I told you, but I think she’s a little entitled on occasion.

  70. Bill589 Says:

    A lot of hate for Republicans at this Republican site. A lot of ridicule. Not as much hate for Democrats. I thought ridicule was a leftist thing.

  71. Aron Goldman Says:

    You know you are not going to win the argument with those pics

    Pics? If you’re referring to #61, 67-68, they’re not pictures, but videos from this evening’s episode of 60 Minutes. Click on the play button in the lower left-hand corner of the video screen (the play button will appear when you move the cursor over it.)

  72. Heath Says:

    Lol so Game Change was right about Reid, the Edwards’, etc, but happen to be wrong about Palin.

  73. narciso Says:

    that’s nothing, you should see GOP 12, Has 60 Minutes done any negative stories on Obama, other then possibly he’s not ‘socializing America’ fast enough. I mean its’ been a year, the stimulus was a joke, the health care bill an atrocity, the embrace of Iran, and the abandonment of it’s dissidents
    a scandal.

  74. AKReport Says:

    funny how mccain aids blame palin even though she was the only thing that gave life to mccain.

    all this trash talk of palin just makes her stronger, and underestimated. thats the last thing you want to do.

  75. Martha Says:

    Oh my heavens, one lawyer searching the internet to vet Palin.

  76. Aron Goldman Says:

    Palin Emerges
    Steve Schmidt, chief strategist of John McCain’s presidential campaign, explains how Sarah Palin became the GOP’s candidate for vice president.

    Watch CBS News Videos Online

  77. conservmom Says:

    56. Yes, we have a special room on the net’s that give us our talking points. You got us ‘rombots’ figured out. Actually, the truth is a bit easier to understand. We all came to our conculsions indpendently, using available resources to reseach on our own. Palin is not fit to be President of the United States. She was a shot in the dark. For crying out loud, they vetted her using one attorney after she was chosen, who never even got on a plane to go to AK and ask questions! McCain wanted a bunch is sizzle. Instead, he got fizzle.

  78. conservmom Says:

    And when the blow back came regarding Leiberman, they should have looked a bit closer to home for a running mate. They should have had several potentials already ‘vetted’ and waiting in the wings. They should have found a way to get Palin off the tickets, where everyone could safe face (Palin could have said she had more pressing family matters, and folks would have bought it), and jumped in with someone else. Nothing was binding Palin or McCain to having her as veep nominee, other than the false hope that things would get better. They did not, and we lost.

  79. narciso Says:

    A former White House counsel, is much more than one lone lawyer. Did Schmidt give any inkling of any strategy he was going to use to counter Obama, either now or then. How does he feel about his candidate being mocked for imposing a refundable tax, and Obama going beyond and taxing everything on god’s green earth. I mean he is nominally a Republican, or does he want us all to be bailed out like his former client Schwartzenegger

  80. Martha Says:

    “No, it’s God’s plan.” Oh sheesh.

  81. Martha Says:

    Unfortunately, it says a lot about McCain that he truly believed his top 2 choices were Lieberman and Palin.

  82. Martha Says:

    Palin fans get what they apparently want: a person who is utterly ordinary, One of Us, Authentic. I actually feel kind of sorry for Palin. She’s got extreme confidence but nothing on which to base that confidence. She was non-plussed at being named VP for the most important job in the world? How is that possible? Is she really not with it enough to know that it would entail actual qualifications?

    Palin’s gotten by on looks and persona for years now. The fact that she thought it would be enough is scary indeed.

  83. No RomneyCare! Says:

    77. So you’r sayin’ that your 100% total agreement with the Daily Kos’ robots…

    regarding SARAH PALIN

    is just a mere coincidence. Really, now?

  84. conservmom Says:

    So True Martha. Of all the GOP he had to choose from. from outstanding compentent women who had actual experience and few skeletons beggin to come out and dance, to skilled men with management and executive experience. Heck, he even had someone of the highest caliber like Mitt Romney in his back pocket. So many to choose from. And he plays the senility card with Leiberman and/or Palin.

  85. conservmom Says:

    I never read the daily Kos. You seem to know more about that site than I do. We just do our own research, and think for ourselves. We don’t walk lockstep over the cliff. Guess it’s because we went to ‘elite’ schools, ya think?

  86. DaveG Says:

    DaveG, you mention Ayn Rand in a lot of your pieces. Are you a fan, by chance?

    A friend of mine is trying to get me to read one of her books. She wants to lend me the Fountainhead, so I will probably find time to read it, even though it’s reportedly very long. I do like her basic philosophy of the individual’s own happiness being his purpose in life.

  87. Alex Knepper Says:

    86 – Honestly, if you just want the essence of her thought, reading “The Virtue of Selfishness” will suffice. That’s about 170 pages. I also highly recommend “The Return of the Primitive” and “Capitalism: the Unknown Ideal.” I’ve never read The Fountainhead or Atlas Shrugged. Too long!

  88. Alex Knepper Says:

    I swear to God, these people whose only rebuttal to anything is “LOL U GOT THAT FROM THE DAILY KOS” — It’s like a denial mechanism or something.

    Zionist News: “Hitler wants to take over the world.”
    Nazis: “Zionist News is a tool of the Jews!” — Yes, but is the information true?

  89. narciso Says:

    They will probably end up like the fellow Dan Fagan, who has excoriated Sarah at a very personal level for the better part of a year, then wonders why there is no one up there that really challenges Obama’s policies. I mean let’s get serious, a rich Mormon investment banker, how many
    ways do you think Axelrod will find to flay him, and the truth won’t matter, it certainly doesn’t matter here, for the most part

  90. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Alex, chill out. :)

  91. Aron Goldman Says:

    Steve Schmidt: Sarah Palin has trouble with truth
    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0110/31335.html

    John McCain’s top campaign strategist said in an interview Sunday that Sarah Palin was dishonest as the GOP’s vice-presidential nominee and that her untruths have done long-term damage to her public image.

    “There were numerous instances that she said things that were – that were not accurate that ultimately, the campaign had to deal with,” said Steve Schmidt in an interview broadcast on CBS’s “60 Minutes.” “And that opened the door to criticism that she was being untruthful and inaccurate. And I think that is something that continues to this day.”

    Schmidt cited an ethics report on the then-Alaska governor from her home state on an investigation into whether she had improperly used her government position.

    “She went out and said, you know, ‘This report completely exonerates me,’” Schmidt said. “And in fact, it – it didn’t. You know it’s the equivalent of saying down is up and up is down. It was provably, demonstrably untrue.”

    Heilemann said that even after crash-course tutorials by campaign aides following the convention, Palin was still woefully uninformed about basic policy issues.

    “[S]he still didn’t really understand why there was a North Korea and a South Korea,” Heilemann told the program’s Anderson Cooper. “She was still regularly saying that Saddam Hussein had been behind 9/11.”

    “And literally the next day, her son was about to ship off to Iraq. And when they asked her who her son was going to fight, she couldn’t explain that.”

    McCain aide: Palin believed candidacy ‘God’s plan’
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/10/AR2010011002297_pf.html

    2008 Campaign, All Over Again in New Book
    http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/09/2008-campaign-all-over-again-in-new-book/

    In the days leading up to an interview with ABC News’ Charlie Gibson, aides were worried with Ms. Palin’s grasp of facts. She couldn’t explain why North and South Korea were separate nations and she did not know what the Federal Reserve did. She also said she believed Saddam Hussein attacked the United States on Sept. 11, 2001.

    The vicious cycle of Palin Victimization Complex
    http://trueslant.com/sahilkapur/2010/01/10/the-vicious-cycle-of-palin-victimization-complex/

  92. No RomneyCare! Says:

    85. They will embrace you and your Palin hatred… Fact.

  93. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Prediction: Schmidt will not be hired next time around by ANY Presidential hopefuls. Way to go, Stevie…

  94. Jonathan Says:

    This sort of thread is exactly why we can’t nominate Palin for President. She is far too divisive even within the Republican Party. Half the Party would jump off the Brooklyn Bridge for Sarah Palin and the other half want to push her off. We can’t have someone like that as our nominee. We would be handing Obama another term.

  95. No RomneyCare! Says:

    88 “is the information true?”

    No.

  96. conservmom Says:

    Alex, They either cite the ‘daily kos’, or call us liberals. It’s as if we don’t kiss the princess ring, we need to be cast out of the party. Think about this. Schmidt went on a national program (something Palin won’t do, unless it’s tabloid like Oprah), answered questions from a far leftie in the form of Anderson Cooper. (Famous Mommy – Vanderbuilt). For me, this sounds like the GOP’s first shot across the bow that the GOP is tired of her, and is about to jetison her back to the tundra. Steve Schmidt admits she was a mistake from the git go. I disagreed with him when he felt Palin held her own against Biden. I thought she got blown out of the water by him. Winkies and blowing kissies works in beauty pagents, but not in Presidential races.

  97. No RomneyCare! Says:

    94. She has a right to run.

    So do Mike and Mitt.

    Let it play out, my friend.

    ALL, three can beat Obama. :)

  98. conservmom Says:

    Nacrisco. What does Romney’s faith have to do with his success in his life? Seriously. This is all you’ve got? He’s a ‘rich mormon investment banker?’. Now I understand where you are coming from. You don’t like Mormons! Otherwise, you would not have mentioned Romney’s chosen faith.

    Romney is also a very successful familyman. He’s a successful Husband and Grandfather. He worked hard in school, learned a craft he was good at. I don’t care that he made millions and billions in his lifetime. What I care about is that he is a good, honest man who works hard, has integrity and I can trust.

  99. No RomneyCare! Says:

    conservmom, you is what you is!

  100. conservmom Says:

    No Romney. Actually, palin could not beat Obama. Nor can Huckabee.

  101. conservmom Says:

    Yes, that is true. So now I have your permission to say that “Palin, a member of the Assembly of God faith, ….. or Huckabee, a Baptist…” So long as we put the religion behind EVERYONE, then I have no problem. But when you put the religion of only ONE – then it sounds bigoted and uninformed.

  102. Jonathan Says:

    #97:

    She has the right to run certainly, but nominating her will cause very deep divisions within the Party.

    Beating an incumbent President is hard. Damn hard. In 1980 with everything that was going on, double-digit inflation, Iran Hostage Crisis, and gas lines it was still too close to call between Carter and Reagan until around November. Carter only narrowly beat Ford who had a recession, the Nixon pardon, and his slip up in the second debate to run against. Without Perot, it is possible that Bill Clinton would have lost to George H. W. Bush.

  103. No RomneyCare! Says:

    And you are what you are.

    But you’re not being fair to our top three REPUBLICAN candidates.

    Thus, Daily Kos-like. Simply true.

  104. Tommy Boy Says:

    “the other half want to push her off.”

    Then I suspect her GOP favorables in the next poll will be 50%?

    Jon, you would probably help your argument a little bit more if you could this mystery 50% who get polled to stop telling them that they have a favorable opinion of Palin.

  105. Tommy Boy Says:

    “could this” should read “could get.”

    I’ll await your post saying “they like Palin but…”

  106. No RomneyCare! Says:

    100. Oh! Now ONLY your guy can win???

    LOL :)

  107. AKReport Says:

    “She also said she believed Saddam Hussein attacked the United States on Sept. 11, 2001.”

    now thats a flat out lie.

  108. AKReport Says:

    that is totally something a few liberals would make up about sarah.

  109. Tommy Boy Says:

    Poll: 70% believe Saddam, 9-11 link
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2003-09-06-poll-iraq_x.htm

  110. Jonathan Says:

    #104:

    As I’ve said before there are Republicans who have a favorable opinion of Sarah Palin but strongly don’t want her to run for President or be our nominee. I use the term “half” as an illustration of differences of opinion over Sarah Palin and her role within the GOP.

  111. Jonathan Says:

    #105:

    At least I’m consistent :) . Besides I have a favorable opinion of Jon Voight, but I don’t want him to be President. Now if Gary Sinise were to announce…

  112. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Watch for the next scientific polling and these results:

    1. Palin
    2. Huck
    3. Mitt

    Stay tuned… ;)

  113. conservmom Says:

    106. No not only ‘my’ guy can win. But the two others you mentioned cannot. I think there are others out there that can win as well. But Huckabee, the baptist and Palin, the AOG, cannot.

  114. Aron Goldman Says:

    Polls, Truth Sometimes At Odds
    Political Views, Psychology Can Make People Believe In Falsehoods
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/12/opinion/pollpositions/main3253552.shtml

    How can people believe something that isn’t true?

    A significant number of Americans say Saddam Hussein was personally involved in the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

    That number rose above 50 percent in the run-up to the war in Iraq in 2003. While that belief has since declined somewhat, for many Americans it still exists. In the latest CBS News/New York Times Poll 33 percent said they believe Saddam was personally involved in the 9/11 attacks.

    As has been repeated over and over, there was and is no evidence of any such link. So why do so many people believe something that just isn’t true?

    One reason might be related to the amount of time a person spends following news, something related to education and gender. Forty-four percent of those with a high school education or less say Saddam was personally involved in 9/11, while just 20 percent of college graduates say so. Thirty-eight percent of women think he was part of the attack, compared with 27 percent of men.

    Another reason could involve feelings about the Iraq war itself, and the importance of reducing cognitive dissonance. The Iraq War has become a partisan issue – three in four Republicans say going to war was the right thing to do, while three in four Democrats say it was not. Nearly half of those who now say the Iraq war was the right thing to do connect 9/11 with Saddam. Consequently, 40 percent of Republicans believe Saddam was involved in 9/11, while just 27 percent of Democrats do.

    Certainly, for many people, linking Saddam with 9/11 may be a case of inversion. For others, it may be wishful thinking to justify their current position on the Iraq war. Either way, it has been part of the belief system of about one-third of the country for many years, and that perception shows no sign of disappearing.

  115. No RomneyCare! Says:

    113. Names, please????

    (This should be good)

  116. conservmom Says:

    Heck, I’d even go for Newt, if he did not have so much baggage.

  117. conservmom Says:

    I’d be huge on Jeb Bush. But he won’t run.

    I like Liz Cheney, but she has said that while her children are so young, she will not run for office.

  118. conservmom Says:

    Thune, Daniels, Hutchenson.

  119. conservmom Says:

    Huntsman.

  120. conservmom Says:

    Pataki, Petretrus (not sure if he’s GOP or not. Generals usually keep party affilation close to the vest).

  121. No RomneyCare! Says:

    I think Mike is a Southern Baptist, conservmom

    AND why are you calling Sarah an AOG?

    What’s that???

    I think you should keep your religion out of this.

  122. conservmom Says:

    Gordon Smith

  123. conservmom Says:

    Assembly of God

  124. No RomneyCare! Says:

    120. GOOD!

    I hope they all run.

  125. conservmom Says:

    Why? You said relgion is fair game, but that’s only if your LDS, right?

  126. Heath Says:

    Palin didn’t know who her son would be fighting!

    Omg please please please no-one take this lady seriously as a presidential candidate (even if only 10% of these stories are true).

  127. conservmom Says:

    I do too, and I hope Mitt wins. But should he lose to one of the others, so be it. It’s only Palin and Huckles the clown I can’t stomach.

  128. conservmom Says:

    Heath. 1 percent true, and were doomed.

    If my son were going off to war, I would damm well know who he was fighting. But then again, I doubt Tractor saw any action. Would you put your career on the line for a gov’s son? No way. I’d keep the guy flying a desk in a nice, safe zone.

  129. No RomneyCare! Says:

    125. When did I ever say that? Proof?

    BTW, Why do you even bring up religion so much???

    AGAIN, I think you’re on the wrong website. ;)

  130. conservmom Says:

    Mate (pronounced ma-tay) is gettng cold. Cheers all.

  131. Zach Says:

    These were the same people who accused her of using campaign money for her own personal shopping spree. Proof! A year later it’s revealed that those aides were lying about the clothing scandal!

    So what am I suppose to believe here?

  132. conservmom Says:

    I don’t narcicos did. You said something about it a few lines back. So, I think that if religion mentioned when it comes to Romney, it needs to go across the board to all.

  133. Heath Says:

    Did Tommy Boy just really just quote a 7 year old poll?

  134. conservmom Says:

    Aides were lying, or Palin SAID the aides were lying? There is a difference here. And the Branchflower report did not exonerate Palin – just the opposite. So who lied? The report or Palin.

    Palin.

  135. Martha Says:

    Tommy Boy, a lot of people like Palin but do not believe she is leadership material.

  136. No RomneyCare! Says:

    132. Proof that I said it or even think it?

  137. conservmom Says:

    Palins husband Toddy was a member of the Alaskan Independent Party – a group who’s mission was to succeed from the United States.

    Palin wanted to lie about it. But seven years of membership cannot be explained away as a ‘misunderstanding’ of what the party was about, as she tried to do.

    Lie byt the McCain camp? Or a Lie by Palin?

  138. Tommy Boy Says:

    #105 Here’s why the argument doesn’t work

    1) You assume that the other Republicans don’t face stronger opposition to their attempts. I would argue that their favorable ratings among Republicans is strong evidence that their hill is steeper since the gap is pretty large between how Republicans feel about Palin and them (I don’t buy the argument with Pawlenty that Republicans will automatically express negative feelings about an unknown). Romney being at 52% favorables with Republicans is pretty strong evidence of opposition in my opinion if an entire half of the party won’t tell a pollster that they like him (it’s unclear with Huckabee because he shows greater variance between the pollsters).

    2) The Jon Voight analogy doesn’t work because someone like Palin is surveyed in the context of a presidential contest. What comes to people’s minds when surveyed is how they view her as a presidential candidate (I think this princiiple applies to Pawlenty, Romney, and Huckabee as well). That’s how people like Billy Graham can claim an 80% favorable rating overall with adults. They don’t view him as a presidential candidate and their feelings about him are not representative of how they feel about him as a presidential candidate because there is no discussion at all about him running.

  139. Martha Says:

    Yes, Palin wanted to tell everyone that Todd just checked the wrong box on his registration form. I guess that kind of thinking must work in Alaska.

  140. Zach Says:

    Palin won’t run but I am sure we will have a strong conservative electoral chanting the words “anyone but Mitt Romney”.

  141. Martha Says:

    But Tommy Boy, a large % of the GOP don’t even believe Palin will run. So many of the people who view her favorably do so believing she won’t run for POTUS.

  142. Tommy Boy Says:

    If you don’t want a 7-year old poll, here’s a poll from 2007:

    http://www.newsweek.com/id/39529

    41% believe it, a greater percentage than the percentage of Americans who believe in Darwin’s theory of evolution.

  143. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Martha is the one with the huge chip on her shoulder and Huckabee/Palin paranoia.

    She can’t stand our TWO top candidates for ’12 and her reasoning is full of slander and petty personal hatred.

    It’s gonna be a long long year if she doesn’t jump on board the PALIN train! :)

  144. narciso Says:

    Lets see he lied about the wardrobe, about the debate questions, they most likely lied about the Saddam point. She understands more than most that the Wahhabis from Arabia are the real foes, the
    Saudis are almost incidental on that point. Who ran the Youtube footage of Rev. Muthee again, I’m trying to remember, Gibson tried to make it seem that God himself was blessing th e troops, when it was an only an invocation of hope, that their mission succeed.

  145. Jonathan Says:

    #138:

    I never said that the other candidates don’t have stong opposition. In fact, I would argue that we shouldn’t nominate any of the faces from 2008 since they are all so strongly divisive within the party. We need a new, fresh face like Mitch Daniels or even John Thune or Tim Pawlenty as our nominee.

  146. Martha Says:

    131. Zach. Most people knew the clothing scandal was not her fault. Schmidt was right about her having some problems with the truth, and he was right to use the example of the Branchflower report, because what Palin repeatedly said about WAS provable false. It did not exonerate her, it said she violated ethics rules.

    BTW – the other report that cleared Palin was issued by a board of people she had the power to fire. Knowing the way Palin works, it is reasonable to believe they may have been concerned about their jobs.

  147. Tommy Boy Says:

    #145 I threw Pawlenty in there as well based on the polling because I have rjected the notion that Republicans view someone unfavorably just because they are unknown.

  148. narciso Says:

    Yes, it was the party of the preceding Governor, Walter Hickel, Nixon’s Secretary of the Interior, the father of the TAP line that Biden voted against, some crazy radical he. The convention was held in her hometown, what she was going to say no

  149. Tommy Boy Says:

    55% of adults believe Palin is honest and trusworthy according to an October CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll.

  150. Martha Says:

    144. Narciso, Do you have any proof that Schmidt lied? But we do have proof that Palin did lie.

    It’s basically the campaign’s word against Palin’s. Why do you assume Palin is the only one possibly telling the truth.

    And how do you know Palin understands anything? Where is your evidence?

  151. Tommy Boy Says:

    #150 See #149

  152. Heath Says:

    142 – thanks for proving what most of the world knows – that Americans aren’t the brighest people!

    Not counting posters on here of course :) .

  153. Aron Goldman Says:

    Alaska Business Monthly Interview with Gov Sarah Palin
    http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-6482074/Gov-Sarah-Palin-speaks-out.html

    Q: We’ve lost a lot of Alaska’s military members to the war in Iraq. How do you feel about sending more troops into battle, as President Bush is suggesting?

    PALIN: I’ve been so focused on state government, I haven’t really focused much on the war in Iraq. I heard on the news about the new deployments, and while I support our president, Condoleezza Rice and the administration, I want to know that we have an exit plan in place; I want assurances that we are doing all we can to keep our troops safe. Every life lost is such a tragedy. I am very, very proud of the troops we have in Alaska, those fighting overseas for our freedoms, and the families here who are making so many sacrifices.

    Gov. Palin and Iraq
    Asked about the surge in 2007, she said she hadn’t “really focused much on the war in Iraq.”
    http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2008/08/29/palin_iraq/index.html

    Seven months into the surge, she still either had not formed any opinion on the surge or the war or just wasn’t sharing. “I’m not here to judge the idea of withdrawing, or the timeline,” she said in a teleconference interview with reporters during a July 2007 visit with Alaska National Guard troops stationed in Kuwait. “I’m not going to judge even the surge. I’m here to find out what Alaskans need of me as their governor.”

    That’s a little weird, since Fort Richardson, near Anchorage, has dispatched countless soldiers to Iraq, including many who did not make it back. And Palin’s own son, Track, is an infantry soldier who could go there any time.

  154. Jonathan Says:

    #147:

    Why would we want to pick a candidate like Romney and Huckabee who have wounds from the primaries and Palin from the general election? How does nominating someone tarred with the 2008 brush push the idea that the Republicans are a change from the past?

  155. Tommy Boy Says:

    #154 Then why did you support McCain in 2008 when he lost in the primaries in 2000? Under this logic, anyone who has ever lost a election would be dead weight.

    Under this logic, we wouldn’t have run Thune against Daschle because of his loss to Johnson in a heavily Republican year.

  156. Dave Says:

    Like one party is different than the other party. The only difference are the big companies who own them. Only a dullard would say otherwise.

  157. Jonathan Says:

    #155:

    As the circumstances stand right now, I just think it is best for the GOP if we don’t travel down the 2008 road again. There are just too many nasty wounds from the 08 election. If circumstances change, then sure we can pick someone like Romney, Huckabee or Palin. It just doesn’t seem like the best move for 2012 to go back to 2008.

  158. Aron Goldman Says:

    55% of adults believe Palin is honest and trusworthy according to an October CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll.

    From that very same CNN poll:
    http://race42008.com/2009/10/28/poll-watch-cnnopinion-research-2012-gop-nomination-3/

    Favorable / Unfavorable {Net}
    Sarah Palin 42% / 51% {-9%}

    Thinking about the following characteristics and qualities, please say whether you think each one applies or doesn’t apply to Sarah Palin.

    Qualified to be president

    •Applies 29%
    Does not apply 71%

    Among Republicans

    •Applies 52%
    Does not apply 47%

    The CNN poll also shows Palin has lost support among independent voters over the last year, drawing approval from 41 percent of them now, 10 points lower than that group’s approval last year. She fares even worse with self-identified moderate voters, drawing only a 34 percent approval rating.

    But her biggest Achilles heel is the number who think she is not qualified to be President. Those numbers are similar to what Dan Quayle got in 1993, when only 23 percent thought he was ready for the White House.

    Here are a couple more…

    USA Today/Gallup 2012 Presidential Survey
    October 31 – November 1, 2009
    http://race42008.com/2009/11/05/poll-watch-usa-todaygallup-2012-presidential-survey/

    Please tell me whether you think each of the following people is or is not qualified to be president.

    Sarah Palin

    •Yes, qualified 31%
    •No, not qualified 62%

    I’m going to read you a list of possible Republican candidates in the 2012 presidential election. Please tell me whether you would, or would not, seriously consider supporting each for president.

    Sarah Palin

    •Yes, would 33%
    •No, would not 63%

    Among Republicans

    Sarah Palin

    •Yes, would 65%
    •No, would not 33%

    Washington Post-ABC News Survey on Sarah Palin
    November 16, 2009
    http://race42008.com/2009/11/16/poll-watch-washington-post-abc-news-survey-on-sarah-palin/

    Do you have a favorable or unfavorable impression of Sarah Palin?

    •Strongly favorable 20%
    •Somewhat favorable 23%
    •Somewhat unfavorable 18%
    •Strongly unfavorable 34%

    Among Independents

    •Strongly favorable 18%
    •Somewhat favorable 27%
    •Somewhat unfavorable 15%
    •Strongly unfavorable 32%

    Among Women

    •Strongly favorable 20%
    •Somewhat favorable 19%
    •Somewhat unfavorable 18%
    •Strongly unfavorable 39%

    If Palin runs for president in 2012, would you definitely vote for her, would you consider voting for her, or would you definitely not vote for her?

    •Definitely would 9%
    •Would consider 37%
    •Definitely would not 53%

    Among Independents

    •Definitely would 8%
    •Would consider 41%
    •Definitely would not 50%

    Among Republicans

    •Definitely would 17%
    •Would consider 58%
    •Definitely would not 24%

    Among Men

    •Definitely would 11%
    •Would consider 38%
    •Definitely would not 50%

    Among Women

    •Definitely would 8%
    •Would consider 36%
    •Definitely would not 55%

    Regardless of whether or not you’d vote for her, do you think Palin is or is not qualified to serve as president?

    •Is qualified 38%
    •Is not qualified 60%

    Among Independents

    •Is qualified 37%
    •Is not qualified 59%

    Among Republicans

    •Is qualified 61%
    •Is not qualified 36%

    Among Men

    •Is qualified 42%
    •Is not qualified 55%

    Among Women

    •Is qualified 33%
    •Is not qualified 64%

  159. Tommy Boy Says:

    #158 Was this data in the poll as well?

    Generally agrees with you on issues you care about

    •Applies 48%
    •Does not apply 50%

    Shares your values

    •Applies 49%
    •Does not apply 49%

    Is honest and trustworthy

    •Applies 55%
    •Does not apply 43%

    Care about the needs of people like you

    •Applies 56%
    •Does not apply 43%
    A good role model for women

    •Applies 64%
    •Does not apply 35%

    Not a typical politician

    •Applies 65%
    •Does not apply 34%

  160. Tommy Boy Says:

    Obama was 48/51 on the first question in that poll as well.

  161. Tommy Boy Says:

    Aron,

    The CNN poll also shows Palin has lost support among independent voters over the last year, drawing approval from 41 percent of them now, 10 points lower than that group’s approval last year.

    Seems a little dated since we have new polling data from CNN…

    Independents are evenly divided on Palin.

    http://race42008.com/2009/12/07/poll-watch-cnnopinion-research-political-favorability-survey/

  162. StephenJacksonville Says:

    Pretty good blog string everyone (mu humble option). Two quick things,
    1. Romney supporter are bombarded with “he’s a mormon so…you know he’s evil, etc, etc” all the time. Gets old, I think thats the place were conservmom was coming from.

    2. Alot of “We need a fresh new face, new blood, etc” so OK, this in for the Leader of the Free World, POTUS, CinC; NOT the contestant for next season of American Idol.

    But good to read from all of you….even No RomneyCare,,:)

  163. Heath Says:

    153 is amazing!

    Rommey (rightfully) was criticized for supporting timetables but really what Sarah said was much worse.

    Oh dear. It’s going to be a fun 2 years if she runs!!

  164. Aron Goldman Says:

    Tories pledge a 75% cut in immigration
    http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2802566/Tories-pledge-a-75-percent-cut-in-immigration.html

    David Cameron vowed yesterday to slash immigration to stop Britain’s population rocketing to 70 million.

    The Tory leader said that if he wins the General Election he will cut the annual influx of migrants by up to 75 per cent.

    Mr Cameron said the number arriving was “too much” – with hospitals and schools struggling to cope.

    He promised big cuts in net immigration – the number of newcomers arriving, minus the number of people leaving.

    In 2008, 590,000 migrants arrived in Britain but 427,000 people moved abroad – leaving the UK with net immigration of 163,000. Mr Cameron said the figure has been around 200,000 in recent years.

    He pledged to use an annual cap to cut it to 1990s levels, when it was just 50,000 a year.

    He said: “I don’t support our population going to 70 million.

    “I think we should be focusing on the pressure on our public services – on health and education and housing. In the last decade, net immigration in some years has been 200,000 – implying a two million increase which I think is too much.

    “We’d like to see net immigration in the tens – rather than hundreds – of thousands. I don’t think that’s unrealistic.”

  165. Jonathan Says:

    For the record, I do hope that Palin runs in the primaries. That way, the voters can finally decide whether or not all these issues really matter. For all the scorn heaped upon primaries, they do serve as a vetting process and every issue a candidate has is aired to the public.

  166. narciso Says:

    162)Actually there has been very little of the kind, except that really stupid thread on Saturday Night, with the Blumenthal video, which was such a low blow. There were some frictions in the past 120-150 years, but nothing to bring up now. Like I say, Romney I’m fairly indifferent about, Now if one were to judge him by his supporters that would be most unfair.

  167. AKReport Says:

    158. thats an old poll. Palin numbers have had a good boost since her book tour.

    134. Palin was cleared from troopergate: http://blogs.usatoday.com/onpolitics/2008/10/palin.html.
    so you can’t call her a liar. plus the first report was just a bogus opinion, and said that she could legally fire him. the report was contradicted if you read the full report. It says no laws were broken but we believe she abused her power.”

  168. AKReport Says:

    “report exonerates Gov. Sarah Palin in the Troopergate controversy.”

    The state Personnel Board-sanctioned investigation is the second into whether Palin violated state ethics law in firing her public safety commissioner, and it contradicts the earlier findings by a special counsel hired by the state Legislature.
    Both investigations found that Palin was within her rights to fire Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan.
    But the new report says the Legislature’s investigator was wrong to conclude that Palin abused her power by allowing aides and her husband, Todd, to pressure Monegan and others to dismiss her ex-brother-in-law, Trooper Mike Wooten. Palin was accused of firing Monegan after Wooten stayed on the job.
    The Palins have argued that Wooten was a loose cannon who had tasered his stepson, drank beer in his patrol car, and threatened Palin’s father, and that their complaints that he shouldn’t be on the force were justified.
    The Troopergate matter became sharply politicized after Palin was announced as Republican presidential candidate John McCain’s running mate in Tuesday’s election.
    The report, released at a Monday afternoon press conference at the Hotel Captain Cook, presents the findings and recommendations of Anchorage lawyer Timothy Petumenos, hired as independent counsel for the Personnel Board to examine several complaints against Palin.
    Petumenos wrote the Legislature’s special counsel, former state prosecutor Steve Branchflower, used the wrong state law as the basis for his conclusions and also misconstrued the evidence.
    His findings and recommendations include:
    - There is no cause to believe Palin violated the state ethics law in deciding to dismiss Monegan as public safety commissioner.
    - There is no cause to believe Palin violated the state ethics law in connection with Wooten.
    - There is no cause to believe any other state official violated the ethics act.
    - There’s no basis to conduct a hearing to “address reputational harm,” as requested by Monegan.
    - The state needs to address the issue of using private e-mails for government work and to examine how records are kept in the governor’s office. Palin used her Yahoo e-mail account for state business until it was hacked.
    http://www.adn.com/palin/story/577323.html

  169. AKReport Says:

    BOTH investigations found that Palin was within her rights to fire Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan.

  170. lutie Says:

    I agree with consermom and martha anyone but huckabee and palin. Palin is completely unqualified and has no discernable skill nor has true fiscal conservative credentials and relies on winks and smiles. Huckabee is a pro life big gov dem

  171. lkv Says:

    Palin was in over her head..she knew darn well she was not ready to do what was going to be asked of her, so why did she agree to sign on as the VP running mate? It’s just one big mystery now, but it’s beginning to unfold….for sure we haven’t heard the end of it, there’s too many people involved.

    Palin can’t keep saying that everyone is out to get her, and her fans can’t keep protecting her from criticism….they’re beginning to sound ridiculous.

  172. Heath Says:

    Not only did she sign on lkv but she is apparently considering running for one better in 2012!

    We dodged a bullet with John Edwards. That should serve as a warning about dumb young pretty narsaccistic upstarts who became celebrities after losing VP runs.

  173. lkv Says:

    #143 RomneyCare:

    Martha’s been here for a long time, does her homework, and brings up some good issues for debate… Because she dares to criticize Palin and Huck with the truth, why do you say she has a chip on her shoulder? Come on now…..

  174. Tommy Boy Says:

    #171, 172

    See #104 and #138.

    You guys may just want to stick to the “nearly every single Republican who is survyed in a scientific poll likes her but doesn’t think she’s ready for the president narrative.” :)

    And then explain the 52% GOP favorable number for Romney among Republicans surveyed in a scientific poll.

  175. AKReport Says:

    “Palin is completely unqualified ”

    Umm WRONG

    she is more qualified then Obama by about 3 years.

    she has 16 years of public office from mayor to Gov.

    was a oil and gas regulator for 1 year and exposed corruption.

  176. Aron Goldman Says:

    she is more qualified then Obama by about 3 years.

    Neither Palin nor any other prospective GOP candidate for that matter (with perhaps the unlikely exceptions of Dick Cheney and David Petraeus) will be able to credibly make the argument in 2012 that he or she is more qualified than the man completing his fourth year as the nation’s Commander in Chief.

  177. No RomneyCare! Says:

    173. Martha is everything that’s wrong with some posters:

    C L O S E D
    M I N D N E S S

  178. No RomneyCare! Says:

    close-mindedness – definition

    Intolerant of the beliefs and opinions of others; stubbornly unreceptive to new ideas …

  179. No RomneyCare! Says:

    “Palin is completely unqualified ”

    -Quotes like these from Martha and her kind is EXHIBIT A. ;)

  180. lkv Says:

    Heath:

    If Palin runs in 2012, she needs to learn discipline and learn how to stay on message or she will have nothing but trouble…..I would be surprised if she runs for Pres., she’s already ticked off most of the people she needs to get a campaign going…..She’s milking this thing for all it’s worth..she’s on the gravy train, and will say anything to get in the news….her main concern now is selling books and getting big bucks for speaking gigs.

  181. No RomneyCare! Says:

    (follow up to 179.)

    I’m not sure that one is really supportive of the Republican Party when I read such hyperbole here.

  182. No RomneyCare! Says:

    180, My friend,

    Whether she runs or not, this is not how you treat one of our own.

  183. No RomneyCare! Says:

    …if you want to win, that is.

  184. lkv Says:

    179:

    Knowing the skills a President must have, what makes Palin qualified to be President?

  185. No RomneyCare! Says:

    BUT if it’s your way (your guy only) or the highway…

    Prepare to lose or to be severely disappointed by the voters. (see IOWA)

  186. No RomneyCare! Says:

    184. The same exact skills that many of our past Presidents have had in our history as a Nation.

    Some more in some areas, others in other areas.

    AND she’s a leader. (Btw, she’s leading your guy)

  187. lkv Says:

    Romney: 182

    Hey, I voted for McCain/Palin, but since the election, she has done nothing even to indicate she is a Republican….If Palin is toying with the idea of running on a third party ticket which would guaranty a second Obama term, couldn’t herself be called a good Republican.

  188. Tommy Boy Says:

    she’s already ticked off most of the people she needs to get a campaign going

    YOu mean Republican voters? I think you would want Republican and Republican-leaning to have a high favorable rating of you to get your campaign going.

    See comments 104 and 138.

  189. No RomneyCare! Says:

    187. Listen up…

    She IS a Republican.

    Martha & the Bots are just stirring up trouble here. \\

    They ARE nutty. ;)

  190. lkv Says:

    #189

    I’m not just criticizing Palin for the heck of it. This is fair criticism of her, she had problems with the McCain Campaign staff, and had problems with the people in Alaska, she has problems with the press, she has problems everywhere she goes. Other Politicians let the criticisms run off their back because there’s always something written or said that is unfair about them, but she picks fights with these people….She needs to grow thick skin if she’s gonna stay in politics.

  191. lkv Says:

    188 Tommy:

    She talks about the Republican machine and the Republican establishment and the elitists without naming names..I mean, who are these people but the GOP… That is the Republican Party, and a necessary part of any political party, that moves the agenda forward…. And the Republican party is still conservative by nature. You could say the Tea Party has become a Political machine and on it’s way to becoming the TeaParty establishment…And now Palin is picking a fight with CPAC and it’s organizers. These are the people whose support she is gonna need to start a campaign.

  192. Alex Knepper Says:

    Too many posts by “No Obamacare! No Romneycare!” in this thread! And he links to the anti-Semite Buchanan.

  193. OHIO JOE Says:

    I for one would rather have the Tea Party establishment pick our candidate, all things being equal than the GOP establishment. Yes, that is a good chance that the Tea Party establishment will choose Mr. Johson over Mrs.Palin, but nevertheless, I’d rather have a new set of character running the establishment than the current set of clowns running the show.

  194. narciso Says:

    She has put a bullseye on Schmidt, who admitted the campaign had lost its nerve in September, after
    the AIG collapse, and the ‘boundless ideaiism’ of the Obama campaign, please gag me. Wallace is yet another. The likes of Murphy, who seemed willing to cede the GOP, into the New Ice Age, Ruedrich and Murkowski back home. The Press, the people who have Obama prepped up on a Sedan chair, for the last year, are you saying there is no bias. The people who proffer the ridiculous Youtube, like the secessionist claims one, created by an Axelrod client, who tried to get NEA business for an Obamacare
    spot, The same people who were keeping Huckabee as a viable candidate, despite his many faultsNow who’s being naive

  195. conservmom Says:

    Um, AK Report. untrue. Taht’s the Palin version. Palin was found to have abused her office. You know that, I know that, and Palin knows that. HOWEVER, the truth is something she just can’t wrap her head around. If she says it, it is so. Right? Wrong. Heck, I did more vetting on her than the McCain camp.

  196. conservmom Says:

    No Romney care. Hum. Funny you’d talk about ‘closed mind’. Your name sez it all.

  197. conservmom Says:

    186. Imagine if you will, Romney saying calmly that being picked for president or Vice President by McCain was ‘Gods Will’.

  198. race42008.com » Blog Archive » Who is the True Tea Party Candidate? | ????? Says:

    [...] See the example post: race42008.com » Blog Archive » Who is the True Tea Party Candidate? [...]

  199. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Sarah Palin Signs Multi-Year Deal With Fox News Channel

    I think everyone saw this coming a mile away…

    Former Alaska Governor Sarah Palin has signed on as a contributor to the Fox News Channel.

    Fox News Channel today confirmed that Palin will appear on various network programming on a regular basis as part of a multi-year deal. No financial terms were disclosed.

    Though no specifics were given according to FNC sources Palin will not get her own show, but will host occasional series that run on the network and appear on other FNC programming.

    http://tvbythenumbers.com/2010/01/11/sarah-palin-signs-multi-year-deal-with-fox-news-channel/38387

    Finally! Somethin’ that ConservMom can watch and enjoy with her family…;)

  200. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Go Sarah!

  201. No RomneyCare! Says:

    Get a life, Alex!

    That is shameful… what you wrote in 192.

    So… what are are you… a freshman or sophomore in COLLEGE???? Which is it????

    Don’t worry…When you grow up you’ll understand politics, my friend!
    :)

    1st) Sarah Palin
    2nd) Mike Huckabee
    3rd) Mitt Romney
    ~47th) Your guy, Rudy Giuliani

    …is how we currently stand… SAD but TRUE

    BUT it could all change tomorrow…but I kinda doubt it. ;)

    See ya when the next polls come out, Junior.

    Oh, I can’t wait till then!!!!!!!

  202. Beck vs. Palin: Battle of the Tea Party ‘leaders’ Says:

    [...] Man triathlete.Why? Johnson is a “natural fit” for the movement, says DaveG at Race42012.com. as a fiscal conservative who is attractive to liberals, he’s [...]

  203. Bill Moore Says:

    Bottom line. Palin raised taxes in the couple of years as governor of conservative Alaska. Johnson never raised taxes (or fees or anything) in the 8 years as governor of a Democrat dominated state.

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